October 1, 2017 at 9:59 pm #2256
For the past few months, the user gbolduev has been discussing his theory on PFS over at the Ray Peat forum. Due to issues with moderation we thought it’d be best if the discussion was moved over here. This theory might also apply to other syndromes such as PSSD and post-Accutane, so stay tuned if you suffer from those.
Gbolduev has stated that drugs like finasteride act as a progestin in the body; meaning, they bind to progesterone receptors. This has many downstream effects, most notably on 3BHSD and many other enzymes (5ar), hormones (estradiol, cortisol, DHT), and minerals (potassium). Eventually, the body gets thrown into a chronic state of imbalance from which it is hard to recover.
The thought is that some people suffer from agonized prog receptors, while others suffer from antagonized receptors. Here are a few treatment protocols that were suggested for each case:
Case #1 – agonized receptors
1) Clomiphene ED 150mg 3 days, 100mg 4 days, 50mg 2 weeks, 25mg 4 weeks; cabergoline 0.25mg E4D; 2 weeks after start, begin taking zinc gluconate 20-50mg + NAD 500mg + vitamin E
*can substitute enclompihene for clomiphene at half the dose
*can substitute dexamethasone for clomiphene as well
*key is to slowly reduce the dose of clomiphene or substitute
2) Progesterone 50-400mg ED for 1 week w/ calorie restriction; then start on zinc + NAD
3) Magnesium 1000mg + B6 100-200mg + NAD 2000mg + zinc 100-200mg
4) Methylation using Thorne Multi-Vitamin Elite
5) Thyroid hormone + zinc + NAD
Case #2 – antagonized receptors
1) Copper 10mg ED; after 3 weeks add in zinc + NAD + magnesium + manganese + B6
2) High-dose manganese + co-factors
3) Estradiol + DHT
4) Andro + relora + licorice root
5) Pine pollen + relora + licorice root
6) Pine pollen + relora + nettle
There are ongoing trials with RU486 taking place. Others have tried fasting, methylation, pine pollen, and Ella (another anti-progestin) with good results. If you are unsure of which “case” you might fit into or have any questions in general, please post here. There are many people willing to help!
Edit: here is a discussion for people who are trialing RU486 for PFS – https://www.lastingsides.org/topic/ru-trials
October 1, 2017 at 10:29 pm #2257
Thanks for the add namaste and for writing the protocols again Gbolduev, the guys need your help and guidance.
October 2, 2017 at 1:22 am #2271
Once gboldev is here this will be legit! We have just repopulated this forum haha
October 2, 2017 at 2:43 am #2278
What a shame about that guy charlie… Seems almost threatened by gbol’s popularity and contributions. I must say though, I like xenforo forum platform and there are a lot of good posters over there. Maybe we can paypal charlie 5$ to have him retire?
October 2, 2017 at 2:47 am #2279
whaddup party people. hopefully gbold can help us out over here. he does tend to get distracted by some of the retards on the raypeat forum so this might be better.
right now I’m doing cdnuts protocol + thorne extra upon refeeding. I feel pretty good like 75-80%. Coming from like negative 10 and wanting to kill myself. So I’m very hapy that I can sleep almost as good as pre-crash. Now to just get that last 25%. I am hopeful. In a way I’m happier than I was before before because I wake up everyday with gratitude considering the depths of hell I was in. 🙂
October 2, 2017 at 3:30 am #2282
I’m happy for you! How long have you been doing the protocol? What is the planned length of your fast?
I’m also planning on doing a fast + methylation before I try RU.
October 2, 2017 at 3:35 am #2284
[quote quote=2279]whaddup party people. hopefully gbold can help us out over here. he does tend to get distracted by some of the retards on the raypeat forum so this might be better. right now I’m doing cdnuts protocol + thorne extra upon refeeding. I feel pretty good like 75-80%. Coming from like negative 10 and wanting to kill myself. So I’m very hapy that I can sleep almost as good as pre-crash. Now to just get that last 25%. I am hopeful. In a way I’m happier than I was before before because I wake up everyday with gratitude considering the depths of hell I was in. ? [/quote]
Haha good idea. Not sure what his deal is at all, seems two faced.
If it doesn’t work out or if we need to switch I forgot I am still a mod on the area 1255 forum as well or I was thinking of just buying a domain/forum like a nice one, but I guess lets see.
October 2, 2017 at 5:03 am #2290
I was thinking the same thing, what we need is unite ourselves and focus on what matters. I was looking for good hosts and systems today.
On pssd forum we have very few active members, the majority are lurkers, but we have some very smart guys there!
October 2, 2017 at 2:50 am #2280
Its curious that this site says accutane has similar sides as PFS. I’ve never had libido loss, just REALLY dry eyes that I’ve had for about 8 years now. I also feel like I could have lowish androgens (feel kind of weak / don’t seem to heal back as well/quick as others my age after exercise).
Do you think doing one of these protocols could help my dry eyes?
Also, did anyone save a copy of the big post that got gbolduev banned? The one mentioned here: https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/post-finasteride-syndrome-5ar-and-the-brain.17354/page-233#post-277404
October 2, 2017 at 3:28 am #2281
You might find success with one of these protocols. It seems that all of these syndromes have quite a bit in common!
October 2, 2017 at 5:37 am #2291
[quote quote=2281]You might find success with one of these protocols. It seems that all of these syndromes have quite a bit in common! [/quote]
how do you know if you’re agonised or antagonised?
October 2, 2017 at 3:33 am #2283
Just got home, trying to get a hold of gbol on skype to get him on here lol
October 2, 2017 at 8:47 am #2295
Hey guys i’m new here. I took fin for 1 year 8 months and start to have symptoms sometime after stop medication.
My last tests:
Testosterone: normal (towards high end of the range)
Progesterone: high, above range
Estrogen: low, below range
DHT: high, above range
Cortisol, Prolactin and TSH: normal but towards low end of the range
Free T4: high, above range
So to start with, which case am I? This hormonal profile makes sense to you? Which protocol could be better for me?
Thank you for you help
October 2, 2017 at 8:10 pm #2309
With prog above range ru may be a decent med to try. Mine was well above range as well.
October 3, 2017 at 9:42 am #2324
ihatefin i’m convinced to try some antiprogestin. ella is my first option at the moment.
I don’t know exactly but my symptoms seems in good part related to low estrogen. I hope these antiprogestin can normalize it too.
October 2, 2017 at 9:48 am #2298
Cheers Namaste for sussing out this forum, big ups!
October 2, 2017 at 12:26 pm #2303
Is there a way for gbolduev to repost his big post which got him banned on RP forum? Really really interested…
October 3, 2017 at 1:08 am #2315
October 3, 2017 at 5:01 pm #2331
Hello there guys,
Just wanted to drop a quick update, im not using ru but some herbs.
Gbold mentioned that estrogen makes you emotional.
Scisandra is estrogen receptor activator: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15256741
Yesterday took some schisandra and music enjoyement was coming back and some happiness with tears too.
Today took tribulus which increases DHT and I had libido this afternoon, while in the beforenoon I had some cocky and funny humour back and some oil on the forehead.
I know its not much yet and not cure but gonna play around with the herbs according to the Estrogen+ DHT potential cure.
October 3, 2017 at 9:18 pm #2342
for those that eat seafood, what’s the best way to prepare mussels / oysters / scallops ? eg) cook time, bake them? raw?
October 3, 2017 at 9:25 pm #2343
fast metabolism = potassium in the cell. bc of thyroid etc.
opposite obviously slow metab.
What do you think of upping the potassium intake? What would that do to slow/fast oxidizer / in general?
I read somewhere people in earlier days were eating way more potassium (5-7g)
Some bodybuilding forums even suggest 7g daily + salt
Im kind of confused what potassium would do. Somewhere I read increasing potassium in food would lower the potassium in cell. Thus it would lower metabolism what would be kind of stupid bodybuilding wise right? (BB is just for example)
October 4, 2017 at 1:17 am #2354
October 4, 2017 at 4:33 am #2358
yeah he is moving to the new site
October 4, 2017 at 1:36 am #2355
I am new to PFS, I have been suffering it for the 4th week now.
I tried to post my story at PH but I could not . below is link at solvepfs.com
I quit the drug because notice that one day I had really soft erection and premature ejaculation. 2 days after I stopped it, It became complete impotence. Later on more symptons developed, I started to wake up tired after 4 hour of sleep every night. I tried to do heavy exercise (a really bad call), and my body crashed after, I could not do exercise due to fast heart beat and excessive sweating. (At that time I was traveling in China/UK). Then after I came back to US, I had few days of insomnia (no sleep at all).
I started to take supplement like Vit B/C/D and L arginine.
I quit the drug on Sep,09,2017
My first lab result (09/16/2017)
PRL 13.89 ng/ml 4.04-15.2
T 11.92 nmol/l 8.64-29
E2 72.15 pmol/l 94.8-223
FSH 7.6 IU/L 1.5-12.4
LH 5.6 iu/L 1.7-8.6
PROG 1.3 nmol/l <4.3
2nd lab result (09/30/2017)
T is 261 300-1000 below normal now
FT is 2.6% 1.3-2.9%
FT(cal) 64 40-220
SHBG is 13 10-60
TSH 1.3 0.5-5
Prolactin is 14.6 4-13
LH 1.8 1-9
FSH 7 1-19.4
I had one day recovery on 09/17/2017 when I had wet dream and erections during the day.
Recently I could sleep for 3hr+3hr ish . And had few hard erection when I woke up in the middle of the sleep. My depression and anxiaty has not appeared for few days. But I’m still having fast heart beat and cold sweating, I could not get my penis hard no matter what I do during the day. I am not sure if I am recovering.
I posted those at different places but no one gave me any reply and advice. I am really desperate now. I am meeting with my endo in 2 weeks. Waiting game is killing me. Do I need to take further action or Should I wait it longer and give it more time ? I feel my body is getting better but fatigue/impotence just won’t go away…..
October 4, 2017 at 1:45 am #2357
October 4, 2017 at 1:37 am #2356
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.